19:20 

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Неожиданно, хотсон :) Далеко не лучший мой текст, но он помог мне закрыть мой хотсон-гештальт.

Шерлок/Джон.
Ау, где Шерлоку 15 лет, а Джону за 25. Джон испытывает влечение к Шерлоку, но не может игнорировать возраст Шерлока.


Предупреждение: АУ насчет даты рождения Шерлока (не шестое января).


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@темы: Sherlock Holmes, Sherlock+John=DUSK, Texts

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2011-07-04 в 01:42 

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EffieL
That still can stop no author from writing a downright angst I think :laugh:
You're right :) Although I can't say I don't like it. The Whoniverse is an endless source of angst, you just go and pick up the loneliness, the losses, the danger and cradle them until they become a text.
Quite a funny fact: I feel more fond of Doctor/Jack than Doctor/Master, though the promise of the latter, not the former, was one of the reasons that dragged me into the Whoniverse. I love them together and love them apart, and they give me the feeling of minus and minus equalling plus, if you see what I mean.

Yep, you're not in Kansas anymore :lol: :lol:
I figured that much )))

Try it someday, it's great
Maybe I will since you praise it so passionately. I doubt I will fall in love with it - I'm content having Sherlock and the Doctor and have so much to look forward to in both of the forementioned fandoms. I treat other potential fandoms with mistrust before even knowing them ))

And actually the presence of the main characters in your Favourite page made me believe in Mycroft/Jim pairing (of which I havent forgotten, no :shuffle2: :shy: :shame: ).
Sorry, I lost you here. The presence of whom exactly in my Favourite page made you believe in myji (of which I'm thinking every day reading the news from Afghanistan, by the way)? ))

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2011-07-04 в 18:31 

EffieL
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and they give me the feeling of minus and minus equalling plus, if you see what I mean.
Like two lonely, tortured souls healing each other?)) Well, you certainly don't get that in Doctor/Master — the closer they get to each other the more they hurt each other, and that's a neverending story) And Jack, I guess, is more into Doctor's idea of fun, he's able and willing to listen and understand (they can be equals... well, almost, which is a big thing already :rotate: ), and who knows maybe he's able to make the Doctor listen too :)

Maybe I will since you praise it so passionately.
:sunny: I can't promise you anything, you may well not like it. I actually didn' intend to even watch the film, but it turned out to be something really well-made, epic, and clever :yes:

I treat other potential fandoms with mistrust before even knowing them ))
I absolutely know the feeling :gigi: :buddy:
Fandoms, fandoms (meaning the "gathering" of fans ;-)) are tricky)) It's strange, but I don't feel myself a part of the DW-fandom as much as I feel myself a part of the X-Men-fandom; wonder why it is so :rotate:

Sorry, I lost you here. The presence of whom exactly in my Favourite page made you believe in myji
Well, these guys. As far as I understand, you remember them very well now :-D

myji (of which I'm thinking every day reading the news from Afghanistan, by the way)? ))
Oh :shame: :shame: :shame:

OK, off to read now :fly:

2011-07-04 в 21:13 

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EffieL
Like two lonely, tortured souls healing each other?))
No, not like that - although this aspect too, but not as the basic one. Like two exceptions who have met and can now establish their own rules for themselves.
They've got all time in the world, they've got interest in each other (and from Jack it's more like a tentative admiring love, even, sometimes - I'm speaking of what I saw on the screen). They both shouldn't be, but they are.
They are lonely and all that, but they are strong enough to cope with that on their own, as for me. They need not so much someone to heal them, but someone to understand; not a nanny or a nurse, but an equal, more or less. Someone to share the burden and the joy with. With the Master the Doctor is never going to get something of the kind. The Master is far too broken to form any kind of relationship except for destruction and despair; he's like a black hole, swallowing all that the Doctor can give and never using it the way intended by the Doctor.

I actually didn't intend to even watch the film, but it turned out to be something really well-made, epic, and clever :yes:
Sounds similar to the beginning of my love to the Doctor )))

It's strange, but I don't feel myself a part of the DW-fandom as much as I feel myself a part of the X-Men-fandom; wonder why it is so :rotate:
If it comes to that, I don't feel a part of any fandom. Can't say it's a bad feeling.
Maybe the reason is in the first encounters with the co-fans. Depends on many conditions - the atmosphere, the age of the fandom, the exact personality with whom you've met first, etc.

Well, these guys. As far as I understand, you remember them very well now :-D
Oh, I see now.
And yes, I know them much better than I'd like to :rotate:

Oh :shame: :shame: :shame:
Erm... what's wrong?

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2011-07-04 в 22:22 

EffieL
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Like two exceptions who have met and can now establish their own rules for themselves.
I guess, a number of near-death and actually death experiences can change a personality significantly so they should have a lot in common, may be more than the Doctor has with the Master, because he is more "human" than any other Time Lord, and Jack is not exactly a human being now))) :hmm:

Sounds similar to the beginning of my love to the Doctor )))
:-D Though I guess, First Class is not as clever as DW, but I can be wrong :rotate:

If it comes to that, I don't feel a part of any fandom.
Really?)) I would think that after two months discussing quite a particular issue of a show one's relationship with "Sherlock" fandom (e.g.) is pretty much consummated :rotate: But, again, it's all quite individual :-D
In the case of DW-fandom I think I haven't met the people I thought I'd meet, I had too high hopes especially after "Sherlock". And I may have been a bit luckier with X-Men :crznope: I think I just enjoy it, sharing something I like with others who like it too, quite a buried feeling for me :plush:

And yes, I know them much better than I'd like to
Ah, why?)) They are amazing actors, both of them :yes: I've had a huge respect for James McAvoy for years and now e-er... discovering Michael Fassbender (and I'm sorry I won't be any consolation to you, 'cause it seems like a huge Fassbender-picspam is going to ensue on your fav. page terribly soon. And it's going to last for awhile. But don't worry, I'll put it under the cut. Well, most of it читать дальше )

Erm... what's wrong?
I'm ashamed because I'm lazy :shuffle2: :shy:

Right, now, fic. I've read two chapters, that is the Doctor has just been beaten up by Jack and run off in his pj))
I like it, though I can't help thinking (and I guess we've even discussed something like it) that the Doctor wouldn't be that passive and depressed, at least not at the beginning. Yes, he's human now, everything is different, but wouldn't he try to deny the obvious as long as he can and run around giving orders and looking for trouble until he realises that there's no TARDIS for him anymore? In this story he is definitely led, and the Doctor can't be led by anyone, that's my impression of him)))

2011-07-04 в 23:38 

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EffieL
I guess, a number of near-death and actually death experiences can change a personality significantly so they should have a lot in common, may be more than the Doctor has with the Master, because he is more "human" than any other Time Lord, and Jack is not exactly a human being now))) :hmm:
Yes. And the life experience of Jack's is much more extended than that of any of the Doctor's companions. Jack is closer to the Doctor in understanding what it's like - to live a long life and to move on leaving people and whole lives behind and to be alright all the time, no matter what.
I'm reading fics with Ten/Jack right now - one by one, as fast as I was watching the newschool, thousands of words in a very short time - and they all try to embrace what we are talking about, but I can't find something truly satisfying, something complete enough for me to relax and say - this is it, it's them, I can leave them where they are and explore something new. But the imperfection of the texts leaves me disappointed and almost... hungry? angry? exhausted? Like a wound inside is being opened more and more instead of being healed.

Really?)) I would think that after two months discussing quite a particular issue of a show one's relationship with "Sherlock" fandom (e.g.) is pretty much consummated :rotate:
Really. I'm comfortable where and how I am but I don't feel actually settled. Maybe that's because the fandoms are already formed and it's not so easy to sneak inside even if I wanted to do something cunning and wily about it. If I get off tonight no one - except you, I guess - will notice my absence. That helps me feel free.

Ah, why?)) They are amazing actors, both of them :yes:
I believe they are good :) I loved McAvoy in other films, like "Atonement"; and though it's hard to remember whether I've seen Fassbender somewhere, I think he can't be a true wreck. But the more I see them when I don't want to, the more they irritate me. A chocolate box syndrom :)

I'm ashamed because I'm lazy :shuffle2: :shy:
You shouldn't be )) It's not some kind of job you have to do. It's all about pleasure and fun.

Yes, he's human now, everything is different, but wouldn't he try to deny the obvious as long as he can and run around giving orders and looking for trouble until he realises that there's no TARDIS for him anymore?
Well, according to the author, this is not possible. He feels the loss of the TARDIS constantly, like a part of his body was taken away; no way to forget, almost impossible to get used to being on his own and in a human body after nine hundred years of being otherwise. There was a talk between Martha and Ianto - can't quite remember in which chapter - when Martha tells Ianto that for the Doctor to be human means quite like for a human to lose an arm and to become blind at the same time. I took that for granted as I think it to be pretty logical and fairly justified. Who can forget that he lost a sense or two and walk around like nothing happened just to stop a few minutes later and exclaim: oh, I forgot, I'm suffering, stupid me!
It's unbearable, I know that. No way to deny something that obvious. That's how it is for me, sure for you it's different as we are different people :)
I just feel now like it was not a very good idea to recommend the story as there is a strong possibility that you won't like it - not believing in the characters - and therefore you'll waste lots of your time reading it and won't get any pleasure. If so, I'm sorry )

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2011-07-07 в 02:39 

EffieL
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but I can't find something truly satisfying, something complete enough for me to relax and say - this is it, it's them, I can leave them where they are and explore something new. But the imperfection of the texts leaves me disappointed and almost... hungry? angry? exhausted? Like a wound inside is being opened more and more instead of being healed.
Why, you know what they say: if you want something to be done right, do it yourself ;-) I wouldn't mind reading some truly Doctor/Jack stuff, they are lovely together :shy: :smirk: A random thought

it's not so easy to sneak inside even if I wanted to do something cunning and wily about it.
God, like what? :hul: :-D

If I get off tonight no one - except you, I guess - will notice my absence. That helps me feel free.
So you try not to get too attached to it, right?))

I loved McAvoy in other films, like "Atonement"
:yes: :heart: There's a funny thing going on with me and McAvoy's films: er, like I sit down to watch Penelope — and he's there, I sit down to watch Becoming Jane — and he's there, I sit down to watch The Last King of Scotland — and you know what happens :lol: And almost all his films are terribly good and I awfully like them, it's like I'm his unconscious fan or something :crztuk: :crazylove:

and though it's hard to remember whether I've seen Fassbender somewhere,
A long shot: have you ever seen Sherlock Holmes and the Case of the Silk Stocking? :rotate: A very long shot :gigi:
And I'd love to tell you that I won't touch upon the subject of those two again, but I really can't vouch for anything) :shuffle2:

I just feel now like it was not a very good idea to recommend the story
Er, don't :yes: And feel free to recommend me anything, I'll deal with it ;-)
So, I've finished the first fic, and as I've said earlier I understand why you think that it's a gem: it is one good, proper story. Everything is really thought out: the plot, the characters, their actions, reactions, emotions. There are men talking about their feelings like men would, and that alone could be enough as an achievement and a sole reason for praise. It's hard not like it, it's one real source of almost esthetic pleasure for a ficreader, plus it makes you think very hard, so thank you for recommending me it :squeeze: And I have a question, is the character of Ianto true to the original? 'Cause I got quite a vivid image from this fic, and I know everyone but him (and Gwen) there :rotate:

But there is a "but" I couldn't manage to get rid of, and it goes: it's not the Doctor. The man in this story is a good man, a clever man... a strong man, but it's not the Doctor (to me, of course). I suppose, I took the whole situation too personally that's why I believe or rather don't believe this man so... vehemently :gigi: You and the author speak about physical changes and I agree, he would need some time to adjust his mind to his body and that would make him feel strange and act strange... but I do believe it wouldn't be so fast. I mean two days and he looks like a man in a grave depression — that's impossible, simply impossible (you have to forgive me, I can't not take it personally). You know, when you cut off a chicken's head it continues to run around for awhile; when you are falling ill and feel really weird and everething around you is weird, you don't fall down immediately — what you do is try to act normal, like you always do and it doesn't matter that you're gonna fall down in several hours. The same thing, I strongly believe, would've happened to the Doctor: he'd try to be himself, to act himself, to think himself and push the pain and weirdness as far as he can because the Doctor is a fighter. And the man we see in this fic is a victim. Different people react to similar situations in a different way, and the Doctor is the Doctor, you can change his cells, but you can't change his character and memories (at least not in this case). Just remember, the Doctor is a man who never stands being bossed around — here it's the only thing he does — he is being bossed around; the Doctor is a man who always likes to be the top man in the room — here ALL decisions are made for him (all of them); the Doctor... the Doctor always thinks — this man is not thinking, he's shutting his brain down (and that's depression, and so to me that's impossible) and that's something such man would never do — because shutting down completely is losing hope (and you remember, "there's always a way out").

You see, my problem is that this person in the fic acts a lot like I would have in that situation. Actually I would have been much worse and total rubbish but similarity is clear. And there's one thing I know for sure, the Doctor... rather I'm nothing like the Doctor. So there's one huge cognitive dissonance for me — I see the similarity where it shouldn't have been, I see myself where I shouldn't have been or at least there shouldn't have been so much of me there. Quite obvious I can't be cool about it, isn't it? :rotate:

The worst thing is that in every other aspect this fic is amazingly thought out, amazingly atmospheric. That's the worst.

2011-07-07 в 02:58 

EffieL
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Oh, and to make it clear, this man is fighting, it's just that I think he's fighting not like the Doctor would've.

2011-07-07 в 20:23 

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EffieL
Why, you know what they say: if you want something to be done right, do it yourself ;-)
God, these words are cruel, do you know that?( I'm not really sure I can write anything now. I've completetely forgotten the Russian language during last days, and when I think of the Doctor and Jack I do it in English. But I can't write a story in English - even if I had a single idea of a text.

God, like what? :hul: :-D
There are ways to become a part of an already formed society whether it's an virtual one or a real one. Elementary psychology gives you the key to become a part of what you want, to be with people you want to be with. In case you do, of course - do want to be a part of something that you are currently not.

So you try not to get too attached to it, right?))
Yes, I do. I've always been very precautious in that matter.

And almost all his films are terribly good and I awfully like them, it's like I'm his unconscious fan or something :crztuk: :crazylove:
Well, you may as well consider yourself one )))

have you ever seen Sherlock Holmes and the Case of the Silk Stocking? :rotate:
Actually I have :) But it was a long time ago. There were some murders of girls, and Holmes found stockings in their throats, didn't he? The part of my memory concerning the film is definitely already blurred.

And I'd love to tell you that I won't touch upon the subject of those two again, but I really can't vouch for anything) :shuffle2:
well, it's okey as long as they are not the only thing we are talking about ))

It's hard not like it, it's one real source of almost esthetic pleasure for a ficreader, plus it makes you think very hard, so thank you for recommending me it :squeeze:
I'm very glad to hear that :heart:

And I have a question, is the character of Ianto true to the original? 'Cause I got quite a vivid image from this fic, and I know everyone but him (and Gwen) there :rotate:
Yes, both Ianto and Gwen are pictured very well and true to the show :) It's one hundred percent them.

But there is a "but" I couldn't manage to get rid of, and it goes: it's not the Doctor.
and that's depression, and so to me that's impossible) and that's something such man would never do — because shutting down completely is losing hope (and you remember, "there's always a way out").
You see, my problem is that this person in the fic acts a lot like I would have in that situation.
O, I see the problem. I saw myself in his actions too. But it was not a problem for me as I remembered that he's human. A human Doctor. It's not exactly ourselves that we see in the text - it's humanity itself wrapped over the memories of a desperate man who's been a Time Lord once but now he's a human, and it hurts like it never did - being a Time Lord is not easy and fluffy-puffy too, but being a human brings different pain, the one to which the Doctor is not accustomed at all.
Being human makes him vulnerable. The feeling of this newly acquired vulnerability and his huge losses terrifies him, and he knows that there is no way out. Not now. No way to become the one whom he had never actually been but whom he so vividly remembers.
That's how it is for me. This alt!Doctor is not the real Doctor, yes, he isn't 'cause he's human. Like us. Like the author of the story. Human like everyone of those six billion people on the Earth.
I guess that's what made you feel uneasy - the humanity of the Doctor which shouldn't be there, which isn't compatible with the image of the Doctor as we know him. But this really is not the Doctor that we know, that breathtaking brilliant alien who never gives up - this is the human one, whom we've seen for several hasty minutes in The Journey's End.
That's how I took it. I didn't expect the Doctor from this story to be the Doctor I learned to love throughout watching the show, I would be unpleasantly surprised, in fact, if he was a copy of the alien!Doctor, because he must be different.
This is it for me :) I don't say that it's the only right way to understand the text and that you missed it somehow, you may be more right than I am and we may be both equally right - it's just what I see in this alt!Doctor. The humanity that the alien!Doctor aspires to achieve but he never will; the humanity which appeared to be not so much a gift but more a punishment.

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2011-07-07 в 22:45 

EffieL
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God, these words are cruel, do you know that?(
That's a tragedy, yeah. There's a great possibility that noone will see this pairing like you do, so that's the only way :rotate: But everything is possible, of course :yes:

I've completetely forgotten the Russian language during last days
If you like, we can switch back to Russian, no big deal :yes:

But I can't write a story in English - even if I had a single idea of a text.
Wow, that's interesting. Do you know why?)

There are ways to become a part of an already formed society whether it's an virtual one or a real one. Elementary psychology gives you the key to become a part of what you want, to be with people you want to be with.
I see, but it doesn't always have to be cunning (the ways, that is), does it?

Yes, I do. I've always been very precautious in that matter.
Yeah, I've noticed :gigi:

Actually I have
:buddy: :buddy: :drink: The same for me, didn't remember him either. Fassbender was the murderer there :yes:
I'm actually quite proud of myself this very moment :super:

well, it's okey as long as they are not the only thing we are talking about ))
I guess, that would be impossible :-D

Being human makes him vulnerable.
But isn't he already vulnerable? He's lost a lot, he's suffered a lot, and he's got a heart that feels for so many beings human and not. And it's all there, and I think it's not so much as him being a Time Lord that has helped him through it, as who he is, as his character. The Doctor is not an average Time Lord, he is very, very different from his own kind ;-)

he knows that there is no way out. Not now. No way to become the one whom he had never actually been but whom he so vividly remembers.
This, I think, would've happened anyway in both the author's and my realities, yes, but it's still too fast. Being a Time Lord helped him to run and run and run, but now that he's human he'll fall down, and hard. It's not the fact that he's vulnerable that I didn't like, it's that I didn't see any transition from one state to another.

I guess that's what made you feel uneasy - the humanity of the Doctor which shouldn't be there, which isn't compatible with the image of the Doctor as we know him.
No-no-no, I see nothing wrong in his humanity))) In fact, I loved all those "becoming human" bits: the body temperature, exhaustion he's never felt before but now unable to fight, the brainwork slowing down, emotions hard to control — that's one part of the transition I think that should've been there, and it's there, and hallelujah :rotate: But where's the other one? The other part? The psychological one? It's not the humanity that puts me off, it's the absence of some character traits which I think should've stayed. And which definitely should've stayed at the beginning where the alt!Doctor hasn't really realized anything and should've (and I'm absolutely positive about it) tried to hang on to the man he remembered, to the man he used to be. The Doctor, IMHO, doesn't need the TARDIS and all of time and space to be the Doctor, that's, I guess, where my point of view comes from :rotate:

read on :gigi:

2011-07-08 в 00:18 

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There's a great possibility that noone will see this pairing like you do, so that's the only way :rotate:
Well, that is the only way, maybe. But I can't write without a key - you remember, I needed a key for my "Photoalbum", and that was photos - and I don't have a key for the Doctor/Jack right now. Some detail which would drag me - and them too - from the dark.
I feel so helpless thinking of them while drowned in imperfect and sometimes simply disgusting texts. Not many things in my life made me so emotional and desperate last years. It's irritating and truly disturbing.

If you like, we can switch back to Russian, no big deal :yes:
It's a big deal for me. There's been too much English around me last month, more than there's been Russian or any other language, so it's really hard - trying to switch into Russian. I don't want to, actually, though it's necessary if I want to regain my Russian grip and write something.

Wow, that's interesting. Do you know why?)
Because you wrote once a story in English?

I see, but it doesn't always have to be cunning (the ways, that is), does it?
It doesn't, but most often it is. It always gets more complicated than expected.

Yeah, I've noticed :gigi:
Does it bother you? If it does, I can try to be more open. Sincerity and vulnerability don't usually kill people, don't think they are going to do that to me if I try :)

Fassbender was the murderer there :yes:
Can't remember him anyway )))

I guess, that would be impossible :-D
It sounds like a consolation :)

But isn't he already vulnerable?
He's never been as vulnerable as he is being a human. Only one life ahead, aging, no TARDIS, no way to run, etc, etc. Imagine yourself standing somewhere unknown - suddenly blind and without one arm, without a place to go, without anything, and with a person you know who - as you think - doesn't want you around, but you've got nobody else. Literally.

It's not the fact that he's vulnerable that I didn't like, it's that I didn't see any transition from one state to another.
Well, the transition is always a problem. Where's the border between making a text boring while explaining and making it not true to life because of leaving too much for the reader to guess? I saw enough to believe in the transition. It's always very personal.

And which definitely should've stayed at the beginning where the alt!Doctor hasn't really realized anything and should've (and I'm absolutely positive about it) tried to hang on to the man he remembered, to the man he used to be.
Well, should he? I don't think so. Although he was very much like the Doctor at the beginning which is proved by the beginning of the fourth fic in the series (but I personally didn't like that one much - the author went too far trying to make every beloved character happy; I prefer "Long Night's Journey Into Day" as a standalone), he - I suppose - didn't feel it to be right - fighting for being someone who he isn't and whom he's never actually been. It seems to him pointless and not honest, I believe.
The thing is, it doesn't really matter what you or me as readers think - whether the Doctor is the Doctor without the TARDIS, the second heart and the sonic screwdriver or not; what matters is what he thinks, and he does doubt. He prohibits himself to be the Doctor, thinks himself a pathetic fake. That could be the reason for the lack of fighting.

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2011-07-11 в 03:00 

EffieL
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But I can't write without a key - you remember, I needed a key for my "Photoalbum", and that was photos - and I don't have a key for the Doctor/Jack right now. Some detail which would drag me - and them too - from the dark.
And you can't generate it somehow? Like turn the two upside down, think of their lives, what those lives were and could have been, or in what circumstances did Jack leave his squareness (?) gun in the TARDIS?..

I don't want to, actually, though it's necessary if I want to regain my Russian grip and write something.
So what are we doing, especially given the fact that you do have to write something? :rotate: Again, no trouble for me in either case :)

Because you wrote once a story in English?
Me or you? :eyebrow: As for me, not once, entirely realizing the prevailing Russian structure of phrases, and doing it entirely for myself)) All because I love it, I breathe it, and see nothing wrong in drowning in a language once in a while ;-)

It doesn't, but most often it is. It always gets more complicated than expected.
I guess so, though I'm not skillful in both cunning and natural and nice ways to blend in :rotate:

Sincerity and vulnerability don't usually kill people, don't think they are going to do that to me if I try
Actually I've been thinking about your strategy, i.e. not being involved into any casual fandom... activity :gigi: As far as I know you never comment on anything unless directly addressed, I was really interested in that fact for quite a while, now I understand — that's cool :gigi:
As for everything else, I've nothing to complain about :no:

OK, 'll be back tomorrow :D

2011-07-11 в 20:23 

EffieL
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Can't remember him anyway )))
I remember that he was real crazy :lol:

It sounds like a consolation
Well, look around — that's our common practice, discussing all the random stuff at once :-D

Only one life ahead, aging, no TARDIS, no way to run, etc, etc. Imagine yourself standing somewhere unknown - suddenly blind and without one arm, without a place to go, without anything, and with a person you know who - as you think - doesn't want you around, but you've got nobody else. Literally.
Yep. But I think there's one relevant point to that: the Doctor's been in the situations of the like, he's been there many times and emerged sort of unscathed, so being an optimist (I'm not one, so that's just a guess :rotate: ) the first thing he should do is think, "Ooh, sounds familiar... Let's try this, and if it doesn't help let's try that". It's been quite a while when he's had nowhere to go, and there's never anyone that can help him, his friends are his important but moral support, otherwise he has to count solely on himself, that's how I see it. And you remember The Doctor's Wife? No TARDIS, no friends, no sane people around, the asteroid that's not even inside the Universe, but sod it it's about to destroy itself anyway — what is he like there? He tries to find a way out and "doesn't care that it's impossible".

This although what matters is what he thinks, and he does doubt. He prohibits himself to be the Doctor, thinks himself a pathetic fake. That could be the reason for the lack of fighting. might well be the case. Rose slighted him, as did the Doctor... Oh, I think I see what's off to me, the Doctor has always seen every and any being as something worthy and important, and I do believe that he really, really ment it (900 years, you can make yourself believe in anything in 900 years). So.. no, one more: the Doctor has an enourmous ego and at the same time he's not a very big fan of himself (Amy's Choice, "There's only one man that can hate me as much as you do"), yes. Actually, he might think himself already a pathetic fake as compared to what everybody thinks of him, and that's based on his deeds and decisions — not on the nature he oh so vehemently claims unable to be imperfect. It's just I don't think he's lying :yes:

Well, should he? I don't think so.
Well, aren't you going to cling to something familiar which by the way is/should be yearning to come out of you? (His character, his temperament — it must be there! :yes: )

Although he was very much like the Doctor at the beginning which is proved by the beginning of the fourth fic in the series
Did the action in this fic take place before the "Long Night"?

Where's the border between making a text boring while explaining and making it not true to life because of leaving too much for the reader to guess? I saw enough to believe in the transition. It's always very personal.
It's not that I don't believe that he could've come to what we've seen, but... Yeah, it's personal :-D
And I didn't mean explaining things, I meant showing them like the author showed the Doctor's amazement at getting tired too fast when before he would've gone on working, the sudden inability to control the physical processes — like that but with existentiality crisis (I remember the scene with Martha and I know it's next to impossible :yes: )))

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2011-07-11 в 20:32 

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EffieL
And you can't generate it somehow?
Well, it's hard to generate it myself, and there's no one to help me. Generating it myself takes a really long time. Really long. One of the things I just can't do quickly, unfortunately.

think of their lives, what those lives were and could have been
Well, I'd have to think of something truly unusual here. I'm fed up with texts in which the Doctor is for one reason or another (usually it's the TARDIS needing some fuel or repairing) stuck in Cardiff and joins Jack's Torchwood as an alien tech expert and an additional pain in the ass; texts in which Jack flies away with the Doctor after The Last Of The Time Lords events and they live happily ever after (after a couple of pages of angst, that is), texts in which the Doctor comes to Cardiff and sobs on Jack's shoulder after saying goodye to Rose, the duplicate and Donna, and - of course - Jack knows just the cure for all troubles.
Sorry, I've just spoilt for you 95% of the Doctor/Jack fics. Didn't really mean to, just was truly desperate.
I've also seen pretty good texts, filling the canon gaps like the two years of Jack's life that he doesn't remember etc. To think of something really good I gotta try hard.

or in what circumstances did Jack leave his squareness (?) gun in the TARDIS?..
Imagine this )))
- Where's my gun, by the way? - asks Jack.
The Doctor throws at him something over the shoulder and Jack catches it.
- It's a banana, - says Jack examining the fruit. - Where's my gun? No, really, where?
- Exactly, - says the Doctor pushing a lever on the console. - It's a banana. Bananas are good. Guns are not.
Jack sighs and starts to peel the banana.
Anyway, he still has one last secret weapon in a place where the Doctor wouldn't reach without Jack knowing.

So what are we doing, especially given the fact that you do have to write something? :rotate:
I'd suggest we keep it the way it is :)

Me or you? :eyebrow:
You :cheek: I've never written stories in English, 'cause it's not my native and I don't feel like I have the right to do so. Russian is my only tool to tell fairy-tales.

I love it, I breathe it
:heart: :yes:

As far as I know you never comment on anything unless directly addressed, I was really interested in that fact for quite a while, now I understand — that's cool :gigi:
You're right, I prefer to avoid starting conversations unless I'm addressed - otherwise it'd be impolite, and I like politeness. You are attentive :)

OK, 'll be back tomorrow :D
Shall be waiting :rotate:

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2011-07-11 в 20:49 

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EffieL
Well, look around — that's our common practice, discussing all the random stuff at once :-D
You're absolutely right ))))

what is he like there? He tries to find a way out and "doesn't care that it's impossible".
But he is still himself. He's still a Time Lord, and while everything else was taken from him, he himself is there, all senses and limbs where they should be.

Actually, he might think himself already a pathetic fake as compared to what everybody thinks of him, and that's based on his deeds and decisions — not on the nature he oh so vehemently claims unable to be imperfect.
:yes: You come to see that pretty often in the show. He feels love and adoration of the people but honestly doesn't understand what he did to deserve this level of affection and loyalty.

Well, aren't you going to cling to something familiar which by the way is/should be yearning to come out of you?
Considering you think yourself to be a pathetic fake - you might as well fight it. Fight your own desires and needs. Fight your memory and feelings if you are convinced that they are not really yours.

Did the action in this fic take place before the "Long Night"?
No, it didn't. There's a series of fics: The Benefits of Being Human... in Cardiff. «Long Night...» is the first in the series. After it there are two minis - fluffy, cuddly, plotless; and one big maxi which concludes the series.

I meant showing them like the author showed the Doctor's amazement at getting tired too fast when before he would've gone on working, the sudden inability to control the physical processes — like that but with existentiality crisis
Well, you made me think - how to show an existentiality crisis in a text without failing the whole text? One wrong detail, one extra word - and the reader is eager to call the text a failure. The physical part is easy to show, but can a human author enter the half-Gallifreyan mind of the character and show it to a human reader? I personally wouln't be able to do that, I guess.

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2011-07-11 в 20:50 

EffieL
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Oh, we were writing them at the same time :-D

2011-07-11 в 20:52 

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We were, apparently :-D

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2011-07-12 в 00:44 

EffieL
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Generating it myself takes a really long time. Really long.
:hmm: It may be worth it :D

Sorry, I've just spoilt for you 95% of the Doctor/Jack fics.
Oh, never mind, I think I'd like to skip the shoulder crying ones :-D
:hmm: You could write something character-based, like the Doctor and Jack are lying on the attic of some house spying on the Sontarans, and they have only one pair of spyglasses, and they are talking and so on... :alles:

Imagine this )))
:lol: :lol: :lol: :peshi: I hope you won't blame me for having to live with this image for the rest of your life? :gigi:

I'd suggest we keep it the way it is
OK)) We're crazy, did you know that? :crzdrink:

I've never written stories in English, 'cause it's not my native and I don't feel like I have the right to do so.
Yeah, it's quite possible to vandalize a language like that, but for a reason unknown this paragraph wasn't included in my moral code :plush: You know what they call a language that lies under a glass — dead, and I think a language should live — in any possible way you can provide)))

You're right, I prefer to avoid starting conversations unless I'm addressed - otherwise it'd be impolite, and I like politeness.
Do you know that very often people write something on the Internet because they want to talk about it?)))

You are attentive
Yeah, somebody kill me already :bang:

He feels love and adoration of the people but honestly doesn't understand what he did to deserve this level of affection and loyalty.
Doesn't he? :susp: I got the idea that he does, he just knows some things that might just make people stop loving him (and if they find these things out and still don't stop loving him, then they are just stupid emotional humans :gigi: ).

Considering you think yourself to be a pathetic fake - you might as well fight it. Fight your own desires and needs. Fight your memory and feelings if you are convinced that they are not really yours.
:hmm: That's actually a great subject to write... This fight would surely be terribly exhausting, and Doctor could've seemed "not himself"
and quite aloof add to that that he is not "all there" physically and you might as well picture a man from the fic. With one little "but" — this fight involves a hell of a lot of mindwork, and one of the first things I told you about the story was that the Doctor wasn't really thinking or wasn't thinking enough.
I don't know, it just couldn't have happened so quietly for him, he's not that sort of a man, he had to "run".

No, it didn't. There's a series of fics: The Benefits of Being Human... in Cardiff. «Long Night...» is the first in the series.
Then it's not the beginning, the beginning I'd like to see anyway :crznope:

Well, you made me think - how to show an existentiality crisis in a text without failing the whole text? One wrong detail, one extra word - and the reader is eager to call the text a failure. The physical part is easy to show, but can a human author enter the half-Gallifreyan mind of the character and show it to a human reader? I personally wouln't be able to do that, I guess.
I told you, I thought it was next to impossible :eyebrow: But I don't think it's that murderous: there are always details that are wrong))

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2011-07-12 в 01:36 

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EffieL
:hmm: It may be worth it :D
Maybe. We shall see :) I'm working on the sheriarty for Leda Rius that I promised a long time ago - remember that? - cause I've finally worked out the key myself. Don't know if it's going to work and lead somewhere. We'll see.

Oh, never mind, I think I'd like to skip the shoulder crying ones :-D
I wish I had done that - skipped them, that is. Mind you, most often it's the TARDIS taking the devastated Doctor to Jack and the Doctor suddenly understands that the old girl knew what he needed from the beginning - he needed Jack to comfort him, hug, wipe the tears, say that it's going to be alright and fuck afterwards. This is practically it.

You could write something character-based, like the Doctor and Jack are lying on the attic of some house spying on the Sontarans, and they have only one pair of spyglasses, and they are talking and so on... :alles:
Well, I could have a go at that. But they deserve a good plot and thousands of words framing their story together, not only a one-shot with banter and chat and sharing spyglasses.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :peshi: I hope you won't blame me for having to live with this image for the rest of your life? :gigi:
I won't :-D Think of it as of a missing scene somewhere in between The Doctor Dances and Bad Wolf :cheek:
Wait, hold on, have I just written out of the blue a small story in English? Have I? Oh, gosh, the Doctor makes me do things I never wanted to do )))

We're crazy, did you know that? :crzdrink:
I'm certain about it, and I like it ))))


Do you know that very often people write something on the Internet because they want to talk about it?)))
Daleks have no concept of talking Well, I've heard of such a quaint notion but never planned on doing something like that myself )))

Yeah, somebody kill me already :bang:
Why should they? :rotate:

Doesn't he? :susp: I got the idea that he does, he just knows some things that might just make people stop loving him (and if they find these things out and still don't stop loving him, then they are just stupid emotional humans :gigi: ).
Well, he does but not entirely. Whatever he does, people don't stop loving him. All his companions, his Children of Time, scattered on the Earth. Never forget him, never stop adoring him. He leaves them behind, he puts their lives at risk, lies to them, tells them the truth about Gallifrey and what he had done to it, they suffer for him, die for him, abandon their families - they love him. Always. Whatever. And he thinks he doesn't deserve that.

this fight involves a hell of a lot of mindwork, and one of the first things I told you about the story was that the Doctor wasn't really thinking or wasn't thinking enough.
Well. Maybe you've got a point here. But then we return to the problem indicated below. Writing he Doctor's POV must be harder than write Sherlock's, for example. It's very big and scary.

Then it's not the beginning, the beginning I'd like to see anyway :crznope:
Saying the beginning I meant the beginning of the fourth fic in the series, here it is: Leaves of Memory. In this concluding fic the Doctor himself is first introduced to the story.
As I've already mentioned, I don't like this one much.

I told you, I thought it was next to impossible :eyebrow: But I don't think it's that murderous: there are always details that are wrong))
It is murderous: you see that you did wrong but you don't know which words to choose to make it right. And it's killing you.

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2011-07-12 в 02:29 

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EffieL
Have you heard that, by any chance? I heard it yesterday and loved it :cheek:


What a pair we'll be,
The Doctor and I!.. (c)

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2011-07-12 в 20:29 

EffieL
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I'm working on the sheriarty for Leda Rius that I promised a long time ago - remember that? - cause I've finally worked out the key myself. Don't know if it's going to work and lead somewhere. We'll see.
Oh, I remember :lip: :kino: She's going to be a bit surprised, I guess :-D

Mind you, most often it's the TARDIS taking the devastated Doctor to Jack...
There are several with the same plot? :wow: :-D

But they deserve a good plot and thousands of words framing their story together, not only a one-shot with banter and chat and sharing spyglasses.
I can't argue with that :rotate:

Wait, hold on, have I just written out of the blue a small story in English? Have I? Oh, gosh, the Doctor makes me do things I never wanted to do )))
Seems like you have :eyebrow: :-D Well, you know the Doctor, he's a bad boy :smirk: :gigi:

I'm certain about it, and I like it ))))
Yep, sanity is highly overrated :friend2:

Daleks have no concept of talking Well, I've heard of such a quaint notion but never planned on doing something like that myself )))
Daleks are capable of more than they realize Well, what you've heard was kind of true :D OK)))

Why should they?
One can get tired of that from time to time :rotate:

Whatever he does, people don't stop loving him. [...] Always. Whatever. And he thinks he doesn't deserve that.
Well, it's good that he doesn't, otherwise we get the Time Lord Victorious and everything he has to offer)) But I think there's still a huge base of self-confidence in him which can't be overlooked :rotate:

Writing he Doctor's POV must be harder than write Sherlock's, for example. It's very big and scary.
Yeah, your brain starts boiling even when you try to think of the timelines and the Doctor's view on time in general, but you can always have a shot :yes: The author actually did that and could've gone a bit further and I would've shut up. Probably :mosk:

Saying the beginning I meant the beginning of the fourth fic in the series, here it is: Leaves of Memory. In this concluding fic the Doctor himself is first introduced to the story.
Guess I have to have a look at it :hmm:

It is murderous: you see that you did wrong but you don't know which words to choose to make it right. And it's killing you.
We-e-ell, looking at it this way it's quite a torture... But the degree of impossibility is so high here that you might as well take it a bit easier... Maybe :rotate:

Have you heard that, by any chance? I heard it yesterday and loved it
:nechto: That's amazing :sunny: :laugh: :dance2:
:susp: :hmm: You know, the woman at the end was right, that was a great idea, it fits so well :heart:

2011-07-12 в 21:13 

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EffieL
She's going to be a bit surprised, I guess :-D
I suppose, she is )) She doesn't probably know that I never forget what I promised.

There are several with the same plot? :wow: :-D
There are dozens and dozens with this feeble attempt of a plot )))

Seems like you have :eyebrow: :-D Well, you know the Doctor, he's a bad boy :smirk: :gigi:
He most certainly is :cheek: If he wasn't, would we still love him that much?

Yep, sanity is highly overrated :friend2:
Sure :yes: :sunny:

Daleks are capable of more than they realize Well, what you've heard was kind of true :D OK)))
Of course they are, Daleks are superior! I might think of it later on, when I have some time )))

One can get tired of that from time to time :rotate:
I don't think I ever will, so don't worry about it :) I appreciate clever and attentive people very much.

it's good that he doesn't, otherwise we get the Time Lord Victorious and everything he has to offer)) But I think there's still a huge base of self-confidence in him which can't be overlooked :rotate:
Oh yes, the Time Lord Victorious can give you some serious creeps.
And you're right, he has self-confidence. He knows his strong points (and weak points, if it comes to that).

The author actually did that and could've gone a bit further and I would've shut up. Probably :mosk:
There is always a "further" or two we didn't manage to reach - but we try. Like in Nikolay Rubtsov's verses:)

Guess I have to have a look at it :hmm:
Do it, but don't expect as much as in the "Long Night..." )

We-e-ell, looking at it this way it's quite a torture... But the degree of impossibility is so high here that you might as well take it a bit easier... Maybe :rotate:
If I take it easier, I should never do it at all, perhaps. It would be like looking at the Everest and thinking: oh, it's so high, I won't come to the top, no way - and I can as well climb a meter or two and stop there before any real difficulty begins.

That's amazing :sunny: :laugh: :dance2:
It is :cheek:
I love his voice, by the way, so it was a double pleasure to find this song amongst the 82 which I downloaded from prostopleer.com.

I also wanted to ask you - have you seen Weakest Link: Doctor Who Special? I saw it recently and found it way beyond hilarious and sweet :rotate:

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2011-07-12 в 22:04 

EffieL
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I suppose, she is )) She doesn't probably know that I never forget what I promised.
I rarely do either)) Some things still torture me :alles:

There are dozens and dozens with this feeble attempt of a plot )))
Well, PWP can have a certain... charm to it if you're in a right mood :gigi: Though it's quite strange there are no good, solid fics about them; Jack's character was introdused ages ago... I guess people get blnded somehow. Perhaps the Doctor shouldn't "defabricate" him after all :-D

If he wasn't, would we still love him that much?
Maybe not :-D

I don't think I ever will, so don't worry about it I appreciate clever and attentive people very much.
Oh, 'kay :shuffle2: :sunny:

Oh yes, the Time Lord Victorious can give you some serious creeps.
:yes: Good that he didn't last — one more point in favour of the Doctor :heart:

There is always a "further" or two we didn't manage to reach - but we try.
Oh, I think the number of these "furthers" is pretty endless, that's why I guess some people ask to physically stop them :rotate:

Like in Nikolay Rubtsov's verses
:wow: Woops! And what's in his verses? :) :shy: :shy:

It would be like looking at the Everest and thinking: oh, it's so high, I won't come to the top, no way - and I can as well climb a meter or two and stop there before any real difficulty begins.
Or you can go on climbing withi=out the fear of depression if you don't succeed :rotate:

so it was a double pleasure to find this song amongst the 82 which I downloaded from prostopleer.com.
:wow: Oh :laugh: Yeah, he's got a pleasant voice and an expressive one, totally worth it :yes:

I also wanted to ask you - have you seen Weakest Link: Doctor Who Special? I saw it recently and found it way beyond hilarious and sweet
It exists? :-D No, I haven't (only saw a gif with David introducing himself :gigi: ), might as well watch, thank you :sunny:

2011-07-12 в 23:26 

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EffieL
Some things still torture me :alles:
They may torture you much longer than you imagine )

Well, PWP can have a certain... charm to it if you're in a right mood :gigi:
I'd be less indignant about it, I guess, if the authors didn't often skip sex :-D They often tell us about a smashing kiss and jump right through to the Doctor and Jack lying in bed sated and content )))

Though it's quite strange there are no good, solid fics about them; Jack's character was introdused ages ago...
Well, there are some, but not many. I have looked through half of what the Archive Of Our Own can offer (I would've done it faster, but yesterday I felt an urgent need to rewatch The Empty Child and as a result rewatched last five episodes of the first series and also The Christmas Invasion as I love this one greatly; and I still continue watching other shows with Tennant and also with Simm) and the results so far are the following: I've already seen a quarter of it on other resources, two quarters are rubbish ranging from utter to mild, and one quarter is more or less good - but not marvellous, alas.

:yes: Good that he didn't last — one more point in favour of the Doctor :heart:
Yes :heart:

:wow: Woops! And what's in his verses? :) :shy: :shy:
Well, I meant this one: Пальмы юга. It actually says about the humanity struggling to achieve new and new goals, never quiet, never satisfied, always so alive. Is there anything wrong with me referring to him?

Or you can go on climbing withi=out the fear of depression if you don't succeed :rotate:
It's natural - to feel fear. And there's the fact that I truly can't reach the top - I'm not strong enough.

:wow: Oh
If I see something I like, I try to take it :) I loved Barrowman's voice in a song of his that I heard by pure accident and I just downloaded in one go whatever I'd found.

It exists? :-D No, I haven't (only saw a gif with David introducing himself :gigi: ), might as well watch, thank you :sunny:
It does ))) His introduction is only a tiny bit of fun and wit you'd see there - they actually made my heart melt, especially Tennant (who could think he can be so shy in front of a camera after years of acting career?) :) You're welcome.

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2011-07-13 в 01:11 

EffieL
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They may torture you much longer than you imagine )
I don't like to believe you, but I know it's true :facepalm3: :-D

I'd be less indignant about it, I guess, if the authors didn't often skip sex They often tell us about a smashing kiss and jump right through to the Doctor and Jack lying in bed sated and content )))
Now that's a shame! :-D I've been actually thinking of my HP OTP (Lucius/Hermione, that is), it was mostly porn, but there was a plenty of good stuff (including the fics "they were lying in bed"), so I'm really surpriset at the lack of good Jack/Doctor fics :hmm:

and also The Christmas Invasion as I love this one greatly
Really?)) For what (well, apart from DT being introduced as the Doctor and his hand being cut off... and the tea :gigi: )? I'm just not a big fan of this Christmas Special :rotate:

Well, I meant this one: Пальмы юга. It actually says about the humanity struggling to achieve new and new goals, never quiet, never satisfied, always so alive.
Oh, I've never seen this one, so amazing :heart: Totally relevant :yes:

Is there anything wrong with me referring to him? Plus he's one of my favourute poets, and you need to do something truly extraordinary to be one because I'm not really into poetry :plush:

It's natural - to feel fear. And there's the fact that I truly can't reach the top - I'm not strong enough.
Well, think of the "Doctor Who" writers)) Not all of them are geniuses, but they do the job, and quite well, I'd say :)

If I see something I like, I try to take it
I'me learning to do something like that and not think it over a thousand times :crztuk:

His introduction is only a tiny bit of fun and wit you'd see there - they actually made my heart melt, especially Tennant
Sounds promising :lip: :lip: :lip:

(who could think he can be so shy in front of a camera after years of acting career?)
Well, there's quite a difference between pretending to be someone else and being yourself — apples and oranges as the dictionary tells me :gigi:

2011-07-13 в 01:45 

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EffieL
Now that's a shame! :-D
Indeed it is :-D

so I'm really surpriset at the lack of good Jack/Doctor fics :hmm:
Maybe, I'm too demanding ))
Although what's disappointing - many authors just mention something platonic or not very much so that Jack feels for the Doctor, but the Doctor himself never turns up and the text appears to be almost purely a Torchwood fic with dominating pairing Jack/Ianto. I don't really object, they are a nice couple, but with my expectations ruined I feel truly disappointed.

Really?)) For what (well, apart from DT being introduced as the Doctor and his hand being cut off... and the tea :gigi: )? I'm just not a big fan of this Christmas Special :rotate:
Dunno, actually. Love doesn't always have an explanation ))) I see all disadvantages of the episode, its straightforwardness and all. I love the feeling of a new life which comes with Tennant firstly introduced - residue regeneration energy or not, he's bursting and sparkling with his newly acquired life contrasting with Eccleston (nothing wrong with the latter, but could you ever call him sparkling like that?). Here are also important tips on his relationship with Rose, his face when he says "it is defended" (he's at the same time the Doctor there and that little touching fanboy who dreamed of being the Doctor and his dream was put into his hands all shining like a star), the song accompanying his choice of a new outfit at the end of the episode... many little things which somehow captured my heart.
There are two my favourite episodes of DW ever, and they are The Christmas Invasion and The Runaway Bride. I just love them, I assume. Don't really know what it says about me and my taste, but I couldn't care less )))

Oh, I've never seen this one, so amazing :heart:
Yes, I love it. Actually, I know it by heart.

Plus he's one of my favourute poets, and you need to do something truly extraordinary to be one because I'm not really into poetry :plush:
He's wonderful :yes: Who else do you like, by the way?

Well, think of the "Doctor Who" writers)) Not all of them are geniuses, but they do the job, and quite well, I'd say :)
I think of them, but it doesn't really help. I'm not going to write an episode of the show exactly, am I )))

I'me learning to do something like that and not think it over a thousand times :crztuk:
Well, when it comes to the music, for instance, there's not much to think of provided you have a good broadband and some spare room on your hard drive :)

Well, there's quite a difference between pretending to be someone else and being yourself
There most certainly is, but he was the only one that adorably shy. If you watch, compare his behavior to that of John Barrowman abd Noel Clarke, for example. They felt absolutely free standing there, joking, answering the hostess' questions, but Tennant was surely being shy. Compare the way Barrowman answers the question "So, does Captain Jack like men or women?" and Tennant answers the question (asked with a certain quirk of the brow) "Is it your right, dear, to be sexy in the show?"

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2011-07-13 в 15:22 

EffieL
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many authors just mention something platonic or not very much so that Jack feels for the Doctor, but the Doctor himself never turns up and the text appears to be almost purely a Torchwood fic with dominating pairing Jack/Ianto.
But it's enough to mention the Doctor/Jack pairing in the header (?) ? Disappointing, yeah. It's almost like when you're going to read a fic about the characters in a certain pairing and you do get them, only through some other character's eyes :facepalm3: The fic can be really good, but it would definitely be centered on that character instead of the pairing

he's bursting and sparkling with his newly acquired life contrasting with Eccleston (nothing wrong with the latter, but could you ever call him sparkling like that?)
Yes, I guess that's the main difference between their Doctors :yes:

There are two my favourite episodes of DW ever, and they are The Christmas Invasion and The Runaway Bride. I just love them, I assume. Don't really know what it says about me and my taste, but I couldn't care less )))
Maybe it says that sometimes it's simple things that count :rotate: And I do love Donna for not going with the Doctor at the end :yes: :heart:
My all time favourite DW Episode will be Vincent and the Doctor and it says everything about me :-D And this guy has a red beard :inlove: , and "My God, where did they find him???!!!" :nechto: And I've watched it only once, but what am I to do with myself? :rotate:

He's wonderful
:hmm: Wanted to find some characteristic of him, and all I can say is "simple elegance", and "purity" maybe — looks like I cannot ask for more :sunny:

Who else do you like, by the way?
Anna Akhmatova))) I still cherish a dream to learn her Requiem by heart :alles:

I'm not going to write an episode of the show exactly, am I )))
Well... You seem to be planning something of the kind, actually :-D

Well, when it comes to the music, for instance, there's not much to think of provided you have a good broadband and some spare room on your hard drive
Yeah :-D Recently I've found out that I like electronic music, so I downloaded the whole The Glitch Mob album and am listening to it like that :crazylove: Not going any further, that is :crztuk:

There most certainly is, but he was the only one that adorably shy.
Now I definitely wanna watch it :inlove: But some things totally depend on a person, of course :lol:

2011-07-13 в 19:39 

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EffieL
But it's enough to mention the Doctor/Jack pairing in the header (?) ?
Enough, unfortunately. Although everything I've been talking about here is not that bad. I saw a fic with Mary-Sue (the main characters listed were the Doctor and Jack, and I didn't suspect anything at first).
That. Was. A. Nightmare. Hope I won't meet something like that any more.

Maybe it says that sometimes it's simple things that count :rotate:
Maybe :)

And I do love Donna for not going with the Doctor at the end :yes: :heart:
Me too. And I love her for her attitude to the Doctor in general. She was the only one to become his true friend without romantic complications; she treated him... healthyly.

My all time favourite DW Episode will be Vincent and the Doctor and it says everything about me :-D And this guy has a red beard :inlove:
I hate beards in general, to be honest )) But I loved Vincent in the episode, he was such a nice guy.
Although, the one Vincent I prefer to any other Vincents is Benedict Cumberbatch's one :)

Wanted to find some characteristic of him, and all I can say is "simple elegance", and "purity" maybe — looks like I cannot ask for more :sunny:
"Purity" suits him perfectly :sunny:

Anna Akhmatova))) I still cherish a dream to learn her Requiem by heart :alles:
Why don't you do that, then? :)

Well... You seem to be planning something of the kind, actually :-D
Well, I'm actually not ))) You know me. I never have a plan. Whatever I write, in meanwhile I don't have a clue how to tie the odds and ends together, what will happen to the characters next time, etc. It just either flows or not.

Now I definitely wanna watch it :inlove: But some things totally depend on a person, of course :lol:
Will you share your impressions after watching? )))

URL
2011-07-13 в 21:20 

EffieL
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I saw a fic with Mary-Sue (the main characters listed were the Doctor and Jack, and I didn't suspect anything at first).
That. Was. A. Nightmare. Hope I won't meet something like that any more.

Oh, the things I'm imagining now... :lol:

Me too. And I love her for her attitude to the Doctor in general. She was the only one to become his true friend without romantic complications; she treated him... healthyly.
"You're not mating with me, sunshine!" :-D :-D
The more terrible is the end of her relationship with the Doctor(( In a way it seems like a writer's suicide, to destroy all the fruits of the character's development, but nevertheless it could've happened.

Why don't you do that, then?
No idea :gigi: Haven't been in a mood crazy enough, perhaps? :-D

Well, I'm actually not ))) You know me. I never have a plan. Whatever I write, in meanwhile I don't have a clue how to tie the odds and ends together, what will happen to the characters next time, etc. It just either flows or not.
I know that, but what if some little thought has already inhibited the back of your mind? :smirk: :rotate:

Will you share your impressions after watching? )))
Of course, if you like :yes:

2011-07-13 в 23:06 

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EffieL
Oh, the things I'm imagining now... :lol:
Do you imagine a Mary-Sue who has a chronolobe - a part of brain which is responsible for feeling time like the Time Lords do it? Oh, the Doctor was most fascinated by her, no doubt, by the end of the second chapter (I didn't go any further, though). I wish someone could help me unsee that.

"You're not mating with me, sunshine!" :-D :-D
I love this conversation ))) And the line about long skinny alien nothing too :rotate:

The more terrible is the end of her relationship with the Doctor(( In a way it seems like a writer's suicide, to destroy all the fruits of the character's development
In a way - maybe. But she's still Donna whether she remembers or not.

Haven't been in a mood crazy enough, perhaps? :-D
Probably :cheek:

I know that, but what if some little thought has already inhibited the back of your mind? :smirk: :rotate:
Well, I've got pictures of them together in my mind. Jack and the Doctor. In the TARDIS mostly. Talking, repairing the TARDIS, laughing, kissing; happy, frightened, uncertain, angry, busy, calm, confused. Sometimes they are not alone, but I'm not quite sure who the others are - Martha, Donna, the duplicate, Ianto, the Master? Not more than pictures which don't refer to any particular story.
Maybe I just love them too much to put it into words.

Of course, if you like :yes:
I would appreciate that greatly :)

Speaking of stories - I found a very good one, not the Doctor/Jack, but with Ianto as the centre of the story, with pairings Jack/Ianto and Ianto/Ianto (and this one doesn't imply masturbation, I must say). It's a very profound angsty text. The events begin somewhere in between Utopia and The Sound of Drums, when Saxon sends the whole of Torchwood Three to the Himalayas - but it's an AU: Ianto stays behind, to monitor the Rift and look after the Hub. It's big one, but for me it was well worth more than just the time I spent reading. It's Paradox in case you'd like to follow my recommendation.

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2011-07-13 в 23:38 

EffieL
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Do you imagine a Mary-Sue who has a chronolobe - a part of brain which is responsible for feeling time like the Time Lords do it? Oh, the Doctor was most fascinated by her, no doubt, by the end of the second chapter (I didn't go any further, though).
:wow: :-D Now that was beyond my imagination :laugh: A chronolobe... is it something you're born with or do you acquire it somehow? :mosk:

I wish someone could help me unsee that.
I definitely can't, but... I'm now downloading Band of Brothers TV series, that's where the Andrew Scott's photo you used for The Photoalbum comes from, and cutting the long story short I can post the caps of him if you have any wish to see them (if there's enough of them, that is :rotate: ) :yes:

And the line about long skinny alien nothing too
"Skinny", the worst thing in the Doctor according to Donna :-D :-D

I'm not quite sure who the others are - Martha, Donna, the duplicate, Ianto, the Master?
... Or they could babysit the little River :shy: :crztuk: :facepalm3:

Maybe I just love them too much to put it into words.
"Words are only painted fire..." Also, Mr. Tutchev was right, too :-D
And sometimes putting something into words makes it less... yours I guess :yes:

... It's Paradox in case you'd like to follow my recommendation.
Alright, we'll see))) Ianto again, heh? :-D

And now I'm definitely off to watch The Weakest Link, I might need it :alles::alles:

   

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